The Wisdom of Religion? (Page 5)

rumi9: Su Ni Chang.. I have been asking myself through out past many years the same question and tend to come up with the conclusion that the underlying principles across religions remain the same. But the inner essence of religions is at first monotheism(saying One singular God) then it further extends to Pantheism(i.e. the very being itself is God).

To support the above, take the examples, Christian Gnostics, Muslim Sufis and Jewish Kabbalists are all into saying that all what exist is God. (Not that a Singular God created the universe staying apart from the creation). Coming back to east, Bhudhism, Zen, Advaita of Hinduism are all interpreting the oneness of god as in the above context. I'm not into blaspheme that there is no God out there,staying apart, controlling all of us being in an unknown realm, but i'm into re-reading the scripture i know. God knows best.

The thread was a kind of enjoyable reading! Thanks!

Zanjan: " I do not believe an individual needs religion to be a decent human being with morals. "

That would be an interpretation of what is decent. No individual can maintain a steady moral status bar with out a strong incentive. He could be truthful on some things, but lie when tempted. He could be kind and generous to beggars but creatively cook the books on taxes.

Morals in society change every year - what was totally immoral when I was young is now considered moral. Ethics have taken a serious beating in the last 30 years too.

How many times I've heard a mother say "Well, my kids turned out ok"......and I think to myself, 'compared to what?' It's relative, isn't it?

There's both honor and treachery amongst thieves; and there's both truthfulness and hypocrisy amongst the religious. Which is worse - murder or torture? Stealing all the money from shareholders or rape? Well, he was a liar but never a doper.......uh huh.

Morality isn't a fad or perception of what's acceptable - true morality is based on what actually harms or heals individuals/groups in the short and long term. Unfortunately, many people don't accept the pain and suffering of others as having been caused by their own actions.

So, you may not see yourself as harming any individual today, but the decisions you've made could still harm an organization and ultimately, the environment of future generations.

"Pantheism(i.e. the very being itself is God)"

One cannot be the Creator and Created simultaneously. God is the absolute perfection.........if any human can be that, there would be no need of God, Who doesn't war with Himself.

ms bossypants: Wouldn't the world be a boring old place if we all agreed on the same thing?

Zanjan, considering you know nothing/very little about me or my personal life that is a pretty broad generalization.

But I do wish you peace

Su Ni Chang: rumi...

My belief is, that of course we are all created by a diety. That we have the the 'essence' of that creator being, just as a painting has 'the essence' of it's artist.

For example, we dont know, and have never met Leonardo da Vinci. We know that Mr de Vinci exists, and no one would question his existance because his legacy is the most famous, and the most recognised painting in the world, the Mona Lisa.

We have many people who have also painted the Monal Lisa or used the image...maybe for fun, or as a class project, or sometimes for ill intentions. We have seen the painting in advertisement, and product logos, and religious icons as well, but we all know the origin of the image, whether it is on a bottle of spegetti sauce, or hanging in a museum.

I belive that our foundation for morals and ethical values are from our common creator. We dont question the creator's existance, because we see the creation, and we know that we are incapable of doing it, even if we can explain scientifically how it happened.

Whether we belive in God or not, or whether we use religion as a path or not is irrelevent to whether we exibit good morals and ethical values. We know what is good, because it benefits us, and we know what is not good, because it does not benefit us. In other words, if you are doing the right thing for the sake of right, you are manifesting the 'essence of the creator being' , and if you are not, you are purposely over riding it for your own selfish gains.

Blackshoes: Zanjan... I agree all of what you stated,It has already been written down in the book of Romans ..

Zanjan: I forgot what was written there......LOL. I'm certain that all great truths can be found in many places, both modern and very ancient; if you find enough places and religions that agree on a thing, you have a collective wisdom that's pretty hard to beat. I, for one, wouldn't dispute it.

The Hindu bow is a lovely way to express respect for that noble "God-light" we have in us all. I don't think it was ever in their minds that pieces of God existed in each human. For instance, when you're in a dark room and throw open a window, light bursts into the room - the sun remains in its position. The light in the room comes from the sun but doesn't reveal its essence - the essence of the sun is a nuclear furnace, which you'd never get close enough to see.

This reminds me of the first white people who ventured into the Amazon and met the 'untouched' tribes. The tribal people were terrified of the camera because they thought it captured their souls on paper - bad mojo.

I look at the Mona Lisa and see a painter's fine talent, not his mind. He was copying what he saw from real life - that woman reveals more to me than the talent. Even so, her mind is unknown.
Leonardo, even with his masterful ability, couldn't incorporate himself into that painting.

Blackshoes: The OP didn't wish me to continue to post in her forum .So I was just repling to your post .I assume you've read Romans.. If not', you may like to .The wisdoms, truth,and knowledge within ',will surly bless you as much as it has me

XWhiteandBlue: Angelo... you are not contributing to the topic... and openly stating intentions to violate the site's ToS... not very wise, regardless of any stance on religion.

XWhiteandBlue:

Unless you're "trollin"

... Angelo; if you get so "riled up" ,by whatever passive-agressive wrongs you have been dealt; that you have to resort to insults...
not only have you lost the argument even before making it...
... but you are openly admitting that you have granted whoever it was that you percieve to have wronged you, the power to alter your mood in a very negative manner.

The wisdom in religion is that it is a WILLING yielding of that power to something percieved to be higher than one's self...
...yet you openly admit to others taking that power from you... even without your willing it?

Stronger indeed...
You are a legend... in your own mind... only.

However, in order to keep this topic on track... I'll assume you are just trolling, and merely ignore any further comments that do not contribute to the thread.
(Most effective way to "kill" a troll, is to starve it to death)
And, yes... for my own amusement, I took one last "passive-aggresive", parting shot jab at you...

Su Ni Chang: angelomicheal.

This is not the intention of this forum. Please refrain from posting this kind of 'anti religion' rhetoric. You can be free to open up your own discussion and make your own rules accordingly.

This forum is not to be judgemental toward other people's beliefs.

Thank you for your cooperation in thia matter.

Su Ni Chang: angel...

I belive that actions and reactions are a choice.

If one disagrees with another, it is a choice on how they do it. Religion and spiritualtiy have nothing to do with having or not having common sense, wisdom, and the thing you did not mention DISCERNMENT.

I do agree that we can be more productive than disagreeing on something that is 'immeasureable'...except that acknowlegement of something you disagee with is giving it measure. For example, if I dont belive in voodoo, then, no matter how much another gives voodoo life, it does not phase me, simply...because it isnt real to me. If I obsess in 'denying its existance' or or promote my views over and above it...I have given it a 'place', and a 'measure' in my life.

In this way, even 'athiesm' can become a 'religion' if used to demean belivers in an organized facion.

No matter how we belive, we only CHOSE to disagree, and we CHOSE to cause contention between another...and everything else...ignorant discourse, fear, bigotry, hare, war, dehumanization, and disinfranchisement of another.

I aslo belive that religion has had a 'profound impact on humanity', and alot of it is positive.