U.S. Bridges and Roads being built by Chinese firms and Chinese workers (Page 6)

davidk14
davidk14: .

The company I work for has over 650 units through out the US. But not one in California. Why?

The regulations and laws to do business in CA is not conducive for business. We would have to double to triple the cost of our product because of regulations. So, our business, policies, practices and procedures are ok for the 49 other states where we do business but it is not good enough for California?

Other countries look at the US as my company does of California.

.
7 years ago Report
0
Comrade_
Comrade_:

"Davidk: Jack, you're just note being clear in your thoughts. You make a statement like companies should be held liable regardless of location and in the same breath, you use the word globalization which leads to, by whose regulations and laws do you hold the company liable? Not hard to understand."

-I'm being very clear, Globalization exist & Capitalism as well as free-trade (whether I disagree or agree to it, isn't the point) It exist and companies misuse it. Globalization can be used to manufacture products with cheap resources, it's misused to manufacture products with cheap labour (sweat-shops or slavery).



You live in a fantasy world Davidk14? You can sit and wait for the Chinese (or any other government) Government to intervene or get a hold of your own companies. Some sensible people already choose to be proactive about it and that has resulted in some companies as Nike getting a hold of themselves. I take it that you're not one of them.

You have a company based in one country and this company supports sweatshops in a foreign country (third world or otherwise) and brings back these products to sell in their country. By-passing the overall rule. You'd be proud of that and lazily say that it's the other country to deal with (whether it's China or any other country).
Because a product is sold in the US doesn't mean that it had no assistence from sweatshops. Vice versa because a product comes from China or any other laxed country doesn't mean there was assistence from sweatshops. That is why as I stated to Serabi, don't look at the country/government, look at the company itself to determine.

7 years ago Report
0
Comrade_
Comrade_: You are bringing countries in it when it isn't guaranteed that the company of any country is a reputable one. That can only be guaranteed when you look at the company and not the country.

7 years ago Report
0
davidk14
davidk14: .

When you go to a relatively nice restaurant and receive poorly prepared food and bad service, who do you blame? The food server and cook or the management?

.
7 years ago Report
0
Comrade_
Comrade_: Your analogies are always bad off, but I like when you pull them out when you're stuck.

You go to a restaurant with a system:
They prepare the food in a poor, unhealthy environment and transport it to the fancy restaurant. Who would you blame? Not the one who owns the restaurant?

Same crap different package.

The prepared location: A country with laxed working conditions & sweatshops
The owner: The company
The fancy restaurant: The original country of the said company and where the goods are distributed.
7 years ago Report
0
davidk14
davidk14: .

Jack said:

They prepare the food in a poor, unhealthy environment and transport it to the fancy restaurant. Who would you blame? Not the one who owns the restaurant?

David responds:

You hold the country accountable for allowing the purveyor to produce the product in the first place. The product is less expensive than a properly prepared product allowing the management to purchase cheep shit. If the restaurant is providing bad food and service, it's the managements fault as well. Ultimately, it's the owners of the restaurant that need to be held accountable for allowing the management to operate in that fashion.

In a past life, for decades, I was a food safety expert for multi-million and billion dollar companies. Before that life, I was a Chef and Corporate Chef for multi-million and billion dollar companies for a few more decades. From the best of the best, to the worst of the worse, I believe I have seen it all.

Lets take an American food company operating a middle level food restaurant in China, just for an example. This restaurant can not operate as it does in America. It can't compete with other Chinese restaurants that have little to no government regulations from building restaurants to procuring food.

You have to have a common denominator of accountability and that is the country the business is in.

.

7 years ago Report
0
Comrade_
Comrade_: It is not a law but the lack of a law, meaning it is not a law in these countries to beat workers or pay beyond low wages. It is the lack of protection.
This doesn't give these companies the right to go in and exploit that. China and these countries are only the "location" the real person to blame isn't the government who fails to provide the protection but the companies who exploit it.
I don't know how to explain it further to you that even though a product such as Nike products are US based that they use locations as China to manufacture their goods and resell it.
You can wait for the Chinese/any other government to change their policies till pigs fly but the real solution isn't boycotting countries it is boycotting companies and making them change their policies.
7 years ago Report
0
Comrade_
Comrade_: That also goes to companies in the US, Europe or South America that use sweatshops.
7 years ago Report
0
OCD_OCD
OCD_OCD: Chinese companies employ the same "sweat shop" laborers that U.S. companies in China do. And do you know why? Because it's legal and acceptable there and China allows it.
7 years ago Report
0
davidk14
davidk14: .

Then...if you boycott American companies in the US, these companies will sell their goods somewhere else. And they do. China sells their crap here (although a lot of there crap is pretty good crap other than the lead and other unhealthy fillers in paints, crayons, pencils, drywall, dog food, baby food...)

.
7 years ago Report
0
OCD_OCD
OCD_OCD: Don't forget toothpaste....LOL
7 years ago Report
0
davidk14
davidk14: .

...forgot toothpaste...lol

.

.
(Edited by davidk14)
7 years ago Report
0
Comrade_
Comrade_: I assume China will sell their products elsewhere as well (as they do have a wider market). The message was for Serabi's moral dilemma, you can purchase what you want, it is a free market, but if you have a moral issue with sweat-shops then it's best to look into the company's history.

Funny thing is you look around your house and you'd find more "Made in China" items. believe it or not even US companies manufacture there.

..must admit this was as drain convo. I don't know how many things you're both aware of or where your goods actually come from but I hope maybe you learned some things.
7 years ago Report
0
OCD_OCD
OCD_OCD: It's so kind of you to enlighten us and tell us what we think, Jack.
7 years ago Report
0
davidk14
davidk14: .

We know of our upside down trade imbalance. We know of the industries we have lost. We see cities like Detroit turned into ghost towns. We see how the steel industry was destroyed.

Believe me, we know.

Why? We lost the leverage of competition to countries that manufacture the exact same products much, much, cheaper.

Believe me, we know.
.
7 years ago Report
0
Serabi
Serabi: Hi, I'm back after a lengthy power failure, at least we know that we will have to rely on our own devices in Malawi, (solar power, gas and back-up generator). So nice of all the shit hitting the fan on a daily basis, as if to prove to us that we have made the right decision to go.

Jack:- Serabi, are you trading with a country or a company? Do you understand where the difference lies? The company that you are trading with use powdered Rhino horns or sweat-shops?

I know that there is a big difference between a country's practices (ideology) and the entrepreneur with his own company. I'm well aware that you cannot paint everybody with the same tar-brush. Some poor ethical guy should not suffer for his country's ideology. See * below. However, you state that Rhino horn has been banned in China in 1993 if I recall correctly. SOUTH AFRICA LOST THREE RHINOS EVERY WEEK LAST YEAR!!!!! We know because the carcasses were found - the horns destination - China. We have a great farmer turned entrepreneur in the Cape:- he has started to farm with Reindeer, the stags throw off their antlers every year, he collects it, powder it and sell it to China as an aphrodisiac, legally - so the practice is still very much alive!

I do not have the finances to travel to China to inspect the factories to see whether they make use of child labour or sweat-shops. We hear about the police cracking down on sweat-shops right here in South Africa, shocking... the culprits are ALWAYS Chinese businessmen. SA deports many Chinese prostitutes, brought here illegally by Chinese businessmen and kept in virtual captivity, passports, cell phones and other documentation taken away.

I may have found a solution for my problem:- I have found a company in India which makes the inflatable domes. I will contact the company in the USA as well - Thanks OCD_OCD!

* The world condemned SA's Apartheid system. Sanctions were imposed and nobody really cared whether the individual companies or citizens agreed with the practice, every SA citizen was penalized. I couldn't go overseas for my 'gap-year', the world shunned joe-citizen. (Just had to bring that into the equation, off the topic, I know.)
(Edited by Serabi)
7 years ago Report
1
OCD_OCD
OCD_OCD: You're welcome, Serabi. Best of luck! I've always wanted a yurt by the lake. Actually, I still would love to have a yurt. LOL
7 years ago Report
0
Comrade_
Comrade_: It is banned doesn't mean that it isn't done illegally, but by being banned means it's not supported by the Chinese government, only by poachers.
You don't have to go to China to inspect you can research the company online, you can't be sure of any company.
7 years ago Report
0
OCD_OCD
OCD_OCD: I have yet to see any company website say "Made in China by slave labor".
7 years ago Report
1
Comrade_
Comrade_: You are right, I haven't seen that on Nike's website or other brand named US products websites.

If the company has a bad track record then it will most likely be openly black listed, assuming that all Chinese-based companies are run by slave labour is...put simple: dumb.

7 years ago Report
0
OCD_OCD
OCD_OCD: Maybe I missed it, but I don't see that anyone was "dumb" and said that all Chinese based companies are run by slave labor.
7 years ago Report
0
Comrade_
Comrade_: Wouldn't be the first time you missed anything.
7 years ago Report
0
OCD_OCD
OCD_OCD: Uh-huh. If we miss something, we'll be sure to contact you, Jack the Oracle.
(Edited by OCD_OCD)
7 years ago Report
1
Comrade_
Comrade_: hmm who is "we"? You have multiple personalities you're referring to?
7 years ago Report
0
OCD_OCD
OCD_OCD: I felt like we were all being lectured. "We" being me, Serabi and David.
7 years ago Report
0