Qur'an and the modern science. Proof No.5 (Page 2) KrAsH: Another truth revealed in the Qur'an is the expansion of the universe that was discovered in the late 1920s. Hubble's discovery of the red shift in the spectrum of starlight is revealed in the Qur'an as: It is We Who have built the universe with (Our creative) power, and, verily, it is We Who are steadily expanding it. (Surat adh-Dhariyat: 47) The first important point to ponder whether is the actual statements of the Qur’an have been honestly presented here. Mr. Yaha quotes the Qur’an as saying in 51:47 “It is We Who have built the universe with (Our creative) power, and, verily, it is We Who are steadily expanding it” The purpose of the above translation could have served well for Mr. Yaha and his gullible followers, but not the sceptics for obvious reasons. Let me quote the three most highly regarded English translations that generally available in the Net [18]. Their versions are: 051.047 YUSUFALI: With power and skill did We construct the Firmament: for it is We Who create the vastness of pace. PICKTHAL: We have built the heaven with might, and We it is Who make the vast extent (thereof). SHAKIR: And the heaven, We raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things ample. None among the above mentioned translators gives the slightest idea of an ongoing expansion of the universe. In fact, none of them refers to the “universe” at all, but to the heavens or firmament, in contrast to the Yaha immediately following which discusses the earth in the following verse (051.048) that I explained previously. Denish Giron also explained in one of his wonderfully written pieces that the verb from which the Arabic word (moosi'oon) is derived cannot mean ‘expand’ [19]. Also, according to Dr. Ali Sina the word used here is moosiAAoona which drives from word vaseun. [24] It means vast. It has nothing to do with expanding. When one says al rezwano vaseun it refers, 'the garden is vast'. It does not mean that the garden is expanding. Any Arab standing in the clear nights of the desert could lookup at the sky and see that it was vast. Muhammad is stating the obvious. There is no scientific miracle or prophecy in this. The cause of the expansion of the universe is scientifically known from Modern High Energy Astrophysics, known as the theory of inflation. The theory is guided by Einstein's mathematical theory of general relativity about the physical universe. These are all characterized, at any instant in cosmological history, by mathematically- infinite space-like surfaces (3-d space in other words). In this (open) model of the universe, everything is expanding in the same sense that the points on a balloon's surface move away from all other points as the balloon is inflated. General Relativity says that for infinite universes, the same kind of expansion occurs. Inflationary cosmology adds to this by saying that we live in a small pocket of some vaster space-time. This pocked emerged from a tiny patch in the primordial space-time and inflated to a vast size (I have written a series of articles in Bengali mentioning the facts of origin and expanding nature of Universe which is under publication in a book format). From the above analysis it should be clear that nothing in those Qur'anic verses come any close to what an expansion of universe really means. Those who want to relate the verse with expansion of universe, do this just by their wishful interpretation or favourable twist. c/p  A_Prince: loooool As expected! you only copy and paste the whole articele from a stereotypical site! Although this article is debunked in the site I mentioned in my previous post, which shows that you have nothing to say nor to do, I'll give you the answer here. Below is a link for a pic I made to illustrate the whole things: http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/8819/illustrationc.jpg Another easy way, go to any Arabic person and ask him what's the meaning of the word in Question and he will tell you! Please, investigate it more. It's funny that you choosed to avoid providing references for your cliam (The Greek and Chinese history) in previous posts to go for another way of debating by copying and pasting outdated debunked stuffs! That shows that your claims have no solid proofs which means they are debunked so far. Peace KrAsH: Debunked lmfao!! So tell me when did all these fake miracles start circulating on the internet? And when you find that out,try telling everyone why it took so long for these so called miracles to start circulating on the internet. Your gullible,and your doing your faith more harm then good,so by the qurans teachings your going to hell A_Prince: Yes, You're debunked and you've just showed a great ignorance of the topic. The Scientific facts in Qur'an is actually an old topic that begun to appear in the 18th century by non-Muslim scientists! It's before the internet was invented many decades then! For example one of first books that were written about such a topic was a book by a non-Muslim scientist named "The Bible, The Qur'an and Science" by Dr. Maurice Bucaille. Some of the well known respected Scientists gave their testaments about the scientific facts in the Qur'an, for example, the well known Embryology Scientist Keith L. Moore. Want more: watch this testaments made by many Scientists about the Scientific facts in Qur'an, I think they know what the Science means much more than you and me! Watch: and YES, again, you're debunked, your way of making fun of the topic shows that you have nothing to say! Your creditability actually is zero for me now, because you showed nothing with any kind of a solid proof or reference! Peace KrAsH: Im not going to watch more islamic lies and propaganda Your just trying to justify your stupidity Smarter minds then you and me put together (einstein,hawkins etc etc) give absolutely no credence to the spam being posted here by you and your like.. A_Prince: loooooooool This is a clear giving up KRASH! Expected, you have nothing to say then! Once you have any thing relevant to the topic to say, I'll be there for sure! P.S.: the video is not an Islamic one, it contains statements by NON-MUSLIM Scientists. Thanks any way Peace KrAsH: So why does islam have to resort to paying western scientist to confirm so called quran miracles? Arguing any points with you is pointless,because you have been brainwashed to believe that anything that doesnt fit into your ideology doesnt matter. http://www.islam-watch.org/MuminSalih/myth_of_scientific_miracles.htm A_Prince: Again you're mentioning things irrelevant to the topic! You're avoiding to stick to the topic because obviously you have nothing to say. and no body paid any scientist to give his statement, actually it's just your mind who can't believe that there are many Scientists believe that the Scientific facts mentioned in Qur'an are true, some of them converted to Islam too! They should have got more money then, Right? loooooool Do you really think in this way? Watch some of them converting to Islam: Peace KrAsH: ^^^ more bullshit propaganda Why did the saudis pay Maurice Bucaille to find scientific truths in the quran? It has everything to do with the topic,i say the topic is bogus,and resorting to paying people to justify lies just confirms that. And stop saying peace im an infidel remember,remember what allah says you should do to infidels A_Prince: loooool Now you proved that you believe in Conspiracy Theory which is not a rational thing to do. You have no evidence that any body paid Maurice, you're just repeating things you don't know about without PROOFS!!! Not to mention you avoid, again, to be relevant to the topic, this shows you have nothing to say and you're DEBUNKED! The videos I posted in my previous posts are made by Non-Muslisms!!! They are statements by Scientists about Islam and Scientific facts in Qur'an, stop being a hater and for once try to investigate these stuffs well in a fair way....If you're debunked then don't take it personal, you have to investigate the topic much more to see if it's true or not instead of repeating outdated refuted stuffs, lies and conspiracy stories, non of them has any solid evidence nor proof!!! and YES, I know you're an infidel, and you've just showed how much you're really ignorant with what Islam really is.What Allah said in Qur'an about what to do with infidels are in many verses: HE said in Surah "Al Kafiroon" means "The infidels": 109:6 "For you is your religion, and for me is my religion". HE said in Surah "Al Baqara": 2:256 "There is no compulsion in religion. Verily, the Right Path has become distinct from the wrong path". HE said in Surah "Al Israa'": 17:15 "Whoever is guided is only guided for [the benefit of] his soul. And whoever errs only errs against it. And no bearer of burdens will bear the burden of another." HE said in Surah "Al Furqan": 25:63 "And the servants of The All-Merciful are the ones who walk on the earth gently in humility, and when the ignorant address them, they say, "Peace!"" So... Peace KrAsH: Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued." Yeh right.. A_Prince: hahahahhahahahaha I swear I knew you'll post this one and still more Hahahhahahah You're getting more stereotypical this way man posting outdated stuffs from hatred sites. You just took the verse from its context to twist its meaning and occasions. This verse and other similar ones are verses in the war cases only. They were mentioned in wars in old times and they are applicable only in wars not in any state else. Peace KrAsH: ^^^ Pot calling kettle black For over a millennia muslims saw no scientific miracles in their koran,then when western science bought us into the modern age 'miraculously' scientific miracles started appearing in the koran.. Either the muslims who couldnt see it for over a millenia were extremely stupid or the current crop of muslims are twisting it to suit modern days needs.. Take your pick.. A_Prince: loooool You're still copying the phrases and concepts written in those hatred sites. Moreover your questions this time look much childish for me. I pick this choice, it is just that you're a big hater for Islam and Muslims and you can't accept the fact that there are scientific facts mentioned in Qur'an 1400 years ago. This fact which was confirmed by many scientists aroud the world and made much of them convert to Islam. The scientific facts mentioned in Qur'an are just signs to show that the Qur'an is from Allah, the God of this Universe. The Qur'an was read by many people through history, not only the Muslims! and no one was able to get these facts from the Qur'an because simply there weren't convenient tools to realize it! The modern technology allowed us all to realize these facts! Imagine you're living in the old times (Greek times) and you tell the people the earth is not a complete sphere, what would happen? After all, it's more than enough that there are Non-Muslim Scientists who gave their testaments about the truth of the scientific facts in Qur'an. Oh, I forgot to tell you about the roles of Muslims in the Science through History, they actually established most of the basics of the modern science and inventions, just to give you much knowledge, go check this site: http://www.muslimheritage.com/ and watch this: and this: Muslims weren't stupid then, right? Peace KrAsH: Hatred sites?? Just because their not pro islamic sites,you resort to calling them hatred sites,typical response from a clearly deluded muslim.. You said...1st book written on the science in the quran written in the 1800's (though no internet search can find such a book).. To which i respond...why take over a thousand years to write this book.. Perfectly legitamate question... Again...either the muslims for over a thousand years were to dumb to notice these miracles,or todays muslims are full of shit.. Im saying the latter Also.. A quick internet search of this planets top 50 scientist from the last 500 years,reveals absolutey nothing about quran science miracles in their thinking....Search for yourself,theres nothing.. So do we believe in miracles that only recently magically appeared,or do we believe some of the smartest people ever to walk this planet.. Not a very hard decision when you think about it A_Prince: Why you repeat your posts? well, here's my answer, the fact that many NON-MUSLIM SCIENTISTS confirmed the presence of scientific facts in Qur'an is enough for any rational person to believe so specially if HE DOESN'T know about science and how to deal with facts in SCIENTIFIC way. Otherwise he can stay in his comfort zone and just keep making fun of these stuffs and post things irrelevant to it at all. Your repeated post shows that you're totally blindly entitled to your opinions without any reference, I suggest that you go see the videos I posted again, they show the statements of the non-Muslim Scientists, the conversion of some of them to Islam and the roles of Muslims through the History in Science...so non of your claims is true To make it easier for you while you're in your comfort zone, here are the videos: Peace KrAsH: Im not going to watch your propaganda videos...period And you keep avoiding the question.. Also on my travels today,i came across a group of 5 muslims,so i decided to ask them of their thoughts on science miracles.. 3 of them didnt know what i was talking about,and the other 2 said those teachings wernt done in their mosque.. So not even all muslims believe it.. Your a joke  A_Prince: They are not my videos, they are not propaganda videos neither because they were made by non-Muslims! I know you like to stay in your comfort zone and you'll stay biased to you opinions blindly without any reference. You're getting more childish in your logic! I won't talk about if you're lying or not although your creditability for me is zero but let's say that your story is true, if there are some Muslims don't know about these stuffs then these stuffs are not true ?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What kind of logic is this? BTW, you're obviously lying and making a fake story because you're telling a story as if these stuffs are taught in other mosques but for those persons they didn't learn so in their mosque but actually there are not teachings about these stuffs in any Mosque, mosques are only for prayers, you just revealed your self, stop lying please! You avoid to post things relevant to the topic and you fail to provide references for your previous claims (the Greek and Chinese History, remember ? )....instead of posting rational things you insist on posting childish stuffs and when I even debunk them you don't want to see the proofs (videos)!!!! Isn't this a blind hate and a non-sense attitude? Peace KrAsH: http://www.islamway.com/SF/quran/ The pro islamist sites who make your propaganda videos dumbass Robert_Paulson: I find it very interesting that the "science proves the Qur’an" argument is a recent one. Can anybody find a Muslim scholar putting this argument forward five hundred years ago? Or two hundred years ago? Or even one hundred years ago? Answer: probably not. And the reason is that it is a modern polemic. You see science is not a recent thing, yet this argument is. Why? Because it is only recently that Muslims have found that people have begun questioning the Qur’an, rather than accepting it blindly. The need has arisen for more proofs of its "divine authorship", proofs that might appeal to a scientific, Western mind-set, as Islam has sought to make inroads in the west. And so this argument has arisen. An interesting thought is this; that whilst the "modern science proves the Qur’an" argument being a modern polemic does not prove it wrong per se, it does pose Muslims who seek to use it with an interesting problem. And the problem is this; that if they are not careful, they will bind the Qur’an to one era. You see, if Allah intended to place science in the Qur’an as a sign, then presumably one hundred years from now, Muslims must still be able to find "modern" science. Yet science will have progressed. So consider: * The Qur’an consists of approximately 6,400 verses. * Let us assume, for the sake of argument, that 10% of these can be cleverly interpreted so that they appear to contain "science". * Therefore we have 640 verses for our source material. Now, as the "modern science proves the Qur’an" argument has become so popular in the last 30 years, verses have been quoted at a massive rate. Let us assume that 20 new verses per year are put forward as containing science. That means (given the 30 years figure) over 90% of such verses have already been used up, and in less than 5 years time, there will be no more source material. Do you see what this means? Looking back in 10 years time, over Muslim history from 700AD - 2010AD, people will see that the Qur’an allegedly spoke to modern science from 1970 - 2002 and then fell silent on the subject; that revelation ran out. What does this tell us? That the "modern science proves the Qur’an" argument is a modern polemic, limited to a small time frame, that will soon burn itself out as the source material dries up. There is NO science in the Qur'an; furthermore there is nothing in the Qur'an that could not have been written by ANY man. | Religion Chat Room 35 People Chatting Similar Conversations |
